Surviving CIA/MKUltra and overcoming pure evil: the story of Dr. Juliette Engel

Those cunning enough and violent enough to run totalitarian nations and empires have their counterparts running amok within many federal agencies and many other American institutions~

Dr. Peter and Ginger Breggin

Apr 26, 2025

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Rarely is one of our shows as intricately fascinating and self-disclosing to our guest and ourselves that we cannot adequately describe all that we covered, all that we learned, and all that we began integrating anew into our knowledge as the interview evolved.

Our guest, physician Juliette Engel, was a captive, slave, and experimental subject controlled by the CIA from early childhood until age sixteen. Acting on her own, she then escaped the CIA/MKUltra house of devil worship — a subject we will let her tell you about in the interview. She began her new life as a college student, and to manage her severe post-traumatic stress, she developed amnesia for her horrendous past. As a therapist and researcher, I know this happens, but it requires a powerful mind like Dr. Engel to accomplish it and ultimately to flourish.

Dr. Engel is part of a growing number of people coming forth about their experiences as victims of CIA experiments, which in part were training her to become a part of what I have decided to call, “the global community of abusers without conscience,” a powerful aspect of the global predators and their unholy empires.

Adding incredible background to her personal testimony, she sent us in advance a document released from the National Security Archive on December 23, 2024. The ominous title is “CIA Behavioral Control Experiments Focus of New Scholarly Collection.”

The CIA documents confirm many of Dr. Engel’s memories, which only began to unfold much later, after a life of medical reform work in Russia.

Confirming Our Own Experiences with the Deep State and CIA

One huge confirmation for me and Ginger is how much the CIA was indeed focused on defending and supporting the very kind or torturous and inhuman psychiatric treatments that I began openly opposing in the early 1970s, including lobotomy and other forms of psychosurgery and electroshock (ECT) which I have described as an electrical closed-head lobotomy.

Another insight for me was the similarity between the CIA agents and collaborators, as described in the CIA documents, and the global predators we have described in our book, COVID-19 and the Global Predators: We Are the Prey. This is the same profile we continue to explore in our recent columns about America’s four current empires: the Western Global Empire, the Eastern Global Chinese Communist Empire, the Russian Empire, and the Caliphate Muslim Empire.

These predators, across a broad spectrum of activities, are primarily motivated by a lust for power over other human beings. They also desire wealth, but mostly as a tool for gaining power. What drives them is the desire to exert power over as many people as possible within their sphere, whether it is a political party, a criminal cabal or conspiracy, a government agency, a nation, an empire, or a global governance.

If they did not lust for power, they would not succeed in their goal of dominating, controlling, exploiting, enslaving, or killing as many people as possible. They must also possess extreme cunning and shrewdness to be able to manipulate and exploit so many people and to compete for power among so many other violent, cunning people. Probably above all else, they must be masters of conspiracy, able to seduce or intimidate others into helping them pursue their evil aims.

These predators must lack identification with the people within their own family, group, nation, or empire, because seizing and growing enormous power usually requires, as history demonstrates, killing competitors in their own families and their own inner circles of co-conspirators, as well as millions of their own people, as demonstrated by apex global predators from Alexander “the Great” to Hitler, Stalin, Mao, and the current leaders of Communist China.

These predators must not allow themselves to genuinely love anyone, because such entanglements and feelings would check or inhibit the kind of evil conduct required for fulfilling their primary lust for power. Ultimately, they must not identify with anyone but themselves.

The following excerpts are taken from the vastly important document that our guest, Juliette Engel, MD, first drew to our attention, “CIA Behavior Control Experiments Focus of New Scholarly Collection.” [The document lacks page numbers, but the excerpts can be located by means of searching the document:]

Excerpt 1 from the CIA Documents

Asked whether the CIA had tried to identify “techniques of producing retrograde amnesia,” Gottlieb said it was something that they “talked about,” but that he could not “remember any specific projects or specific research mounted in response to that question.” Asked if the CIA ever used “psychosurgery research projects,” Gottlieb said his “remembrance is that they did.”

Excerpt 2

The elevation of Allen Dulles to deputy director of central intelligence in 1951 led to an expansion of BLUEBIRD programs under a new name, ARTICHOKE, and under the direction of Gottlieb at TSS. The new program was to include, among other projects, the development of “gas guns” and “poisons,” and experiments to test whether “monotonous sounds,” “concussion,” “electroshock,” and “induced sleep” could be used as a means to gain “hypnotic control of an individual.”[5]

Excerpt 3

Another prominent MKULTRA “cutout” foundation, the Human Ecology Society, was run by Cornell Medical Center neurologist Dr. Harold Wolff, who wrote an early study of communist brainwashing techniques for Allen Dulles and later partnered with the CIA to develop a combination of drugs and sensory deprivation that could be used to erase the human mind. Among the most extreme MKULTRA projects funded through Wolff’s group were the infamous “depatterning” experiments conducted by Dr. D. Ewen Cameron at the Allan Memorial Institute, a psychiatric hospital at McGill University in Montreal, Canada. Cameron’s methods combined induced sleep, electroshocks, and “psychic driving,” under which drugged subjects were psychologically tortured for weeks or months in an effort to reprogram their minds.

Except 4

While no new techniques had been discovered, presently known mind control techniques described in the attachment include the use of LSD and other drugs, hypnosis, the use of the polygraph, neurosurgery, and electric shock treatments. However, field testing of these techniques has been handicapped by the “inability to provide the medical competence for a final evaluation and for such field testing as the evaluation indicates. Repeated efforts to recruit medical personnel have failed and until recently the CIA Medical Staff has not been in a position to assist.”

Excerpt 5

The response from TSS lists 17 “materials and methods” that the Chemical Division was working to develop, including:

*substances that “promote illogical thinking,”
- materials that would “render the induction of hypnosis easier” or “enhance its usefulness,”
- substances that would help individuals to endure “privation, torture and coercion during interrogation” and attempts at ‘brainwashing,’”
- *“materials and physical methods” to “produce amnesia” and “shock and confusion over extended periods of time,”
- substances that would “produce physical disablement, including paralysis,
- *substances that “alter personality structure” or that “produce ‘pure’ euphoria with no subsequent let-down,”
- and a “knockout pill” for use in surreptitious druggings and to produce amnesia, among other things. [Asterisks and bold added]

Excerpt 6

Gibbons was not fully clear on how the CIA obtained LSD, but most of it came from the Eli Lilly & Company, according to this memo, which “apparently makes a gift of it to CIA.” [bold added. There are many mentions in the report citing Eli Lilly as the source of massive of amounts of LSD which the CIA then inflicted upon Americans, sometimes as experiments and sometimes for financial gain.]

End of Excerpts

In the current release of CIA documents, many well-known government officials and universities are named as supporting and collaborating with MKUltra and other ghastly CIA experiments. Particularly stunning to me, the CIA bought a new wing for the Georgetown University Hospital, in return for which the CIA was given a special “safe house” inside the medical wing where they were free to inflict their wanton will on involuntary experimental subjects with supportive help from the hospital.

One More Step in Facing the Evil Within

These quotes confirm what I had long suspected and had only limited data to confirm — that the CIA and other government agencies are very protective and supportive of psychosurgery (lobotomy) and electroshock treatment (ECT). They want to research and apply these gross methods of damaging the human brain and mind to facilitate interrogation, to erase memories, to change personalities, and to make people more obedient and robotic. They also want them widely used in society to dumb down and render passive as many people as possible on the way to building the global slave state.

During this interview, we began to more deeply appreciate the involvement of the Deep State in psychiatry and psychology and the strength of their opposition to my reform work going back to the early 1970s. My earliest reform efforts focused on these two treatments, psychosurgery and then electroshock, and finally matured into seeing all psychiatric treatment as an assault on the brain and mind.

In various books and scientific articles, Ginger and I have been pointing to federal agencies pushing lobotomy (DOJ, NIMH), pushing electroshock (CIA, FDA), and pushing psychoactive drugs (FDA, CIA, NIMH, NIH, Department of Education, and others.

Our greatest confrontation with federal agencies came during an intense few years when we educated and organized people to shut down a massive U.S. interagency eugenical program to go into the inner cities to identify supposed biological and genetic causes of violence in black children and youth. The goal was ultimately to justify the widespread diagnosing and drugging of these children, including highly remunerative drugs like antidepressants and stimulants. I had already encountered outright racism, with neurosurgeons and psychiatrists advocating in print for the use of psychosurgery to control the leaders of black uprisings in the 1960s and early 1970s.

We completely defeated the massive eugenics project, causing the cancellation of a major conference and many research projects. We authored a book about it, The War Against Children of Color (1994), which addresses numerous Deep State actors such as the CDC, Department of Justice, FBI, NIMH, NIH, DHHS, and PHS, and names many perpetrators. But we had not yet seen the globalist scope of these activities. Here are links to a few articles about our successful efforts to stop the federal eugenics program.

The Role of Psychiatry in Nazi Germany and the U.S. Violence Initiative. This link contains the written introduction and historical video of Dr. Peter Breggin’s presentation to Black leaders and community members in Harlem in the early 1990s about the federal government’s plans to biologically “prevent violence” by identifying and drugging Black toddlers and children—a plan ultimately stopped due to the Breggins’ exposure of the eugenics program.
A biomedical programme for urban violence control in the US: the dangers of psychiatric social control; by Peter R Breggin and Ginger Ross Breggin
Letter to the Editor, The New York Times by Peter R. Breggin, M.D.: U.S. Hasn’t Given Up Linking Genes to Crime. Excerpt: “Dr. Goodwin estimates that 100,000 children, as young as 5, will be identified for psychiatric interventions. He called the violence initiative the No. 1 funding priority for the Federal mental health establishment in 1994. My organization has since obtained documentation that millions of dollars of Federal funds are being spent on violence initiative research and planning, including studies of both rhesus monkeys and inner-city children. Newly developed psychiatric drugs are being tested for violence prevention in monkey studies, and some psychiatrists are claiming they can be used in humans for the same purpose. It seems inevitable that the violence initiative will involve administering the same drugs to inner-city children. The widespread use of Ritalin to control aggressive children, frequently supported or initiated by public schools, has set a precedent for pharmacological intervention.”
Disposable Children in Black Faces: The Violence Initiative as Inner-City Containment Policy; Alfreda A. Sellers-Diamond, UMKC Law Review, 1994.
Campaigns Against Racist Federal Programs by the Center for the Study of Psychiatry and Psychology; Peter R. Breggin, Journal of African American Men, 1995.
NIH, under fire, freezes grant for conference on genetics and crime; Nature, Vol. 358, 30 July 1992, p357.

It was further hammered home to me in the interview with Dr. Engel that the kinds of individuals who are cunning enough and violent enough to run totalitarian nations and empires have their counterparts running amok within many federal agencies and many other American institutions. And that is the force from within that we are fighting today as we stand up for freedom in America. We must face a former national leadership, and a current Deep State and other institutions riddled with the worst human beings we can imagine and understand — or we will remain vastly hampered in fighting them.

[Editor’s note: Alfred Kinsey was the driving force in the late 1940’s toward normalizing the early sexualization of children, as well as encouraging “free love” and sex with multiple partners and more. Following are several interviews we have done on Kinsey’s influence upon Western Civilization and the sexualization of America.]

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Dr. Peter and Ginger Breggin

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